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Nibbler

panel - the state of the visual effects industry

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This thread is meant to be a constructive conversation on how to correct the issues presented to us as a worldwide industry. We're trying to bring all the issues to the fore and then figure out a way forward. You can't figure out a way forward if all you're doing is scorning the people who are trying to find a solution.

If you don't even think there's a problem then why participate in the conversation?

Well, sorry to be a troll then.

When reading everybody's opinion that a union is the solution to all the problems in the industry, my "constructive" contribution was to say they're not, and that interfering with the marketplace by artificial means is no good. I thought I worded it clearly enough. Maybe you don't like this opinion, but is as constructive and valid as the opposite one.

As for imagining that a thread on an app-specific forum is meant to be "constructive conversation on how to correct the issues etc.", I'd almost like to say: are you serious?

It's exactly this attitude that I consider dangerous. Suddenly one can't go on any forum or mailing list, no matter how app or field specific, without reading some thread on this, which brings actually nothing new and just repeats ad infinitum: this is unacceptable, we need an union. It's called venting.

Again, to offer you a constructive opinion: we don't need one. Let the market do its job. I don't want to "protect" anything, but I find laughable the view that "there are bad people there who want to hurt us".

Dragos

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Some kind of union would be good just to keep a check on things.

It's not really about total control and constraining market forces. I work on and off in games and I've seen young, eager people working 5-6 days and nights in a row (that's right; no going home, no shower, just ooooffice oooffice office) and that just ain't the way it should be. It doesn't benefit anybody. If there was some kind of organization just to rattle and shake us when we're heading into the wrong direction, that could only be beneficial for everybody.

Edited by Macha

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Some kind of union would be good just to keep a check on things.

It's not really about total control and constraining market forces. I work on and off in games and I've seen young, eager people working 5-6 days and nights in a row (that's right; no going home, no shower, just ooooffice oooffice office) and that just ain't the way it should be. It doesn't benefit anybody. If there was some kind of organization just to rattle and shake us when we're heading into the wrong direction, that could only be beneficial for everybody.

The thing is though, like Dragos said we would almost need an international global union for anything to be done... look at animators. They're unionized in the states. Has it really made a difference for them? I still see animators working unpaid overtime in the studios down the street from me here in Toronto. I still see animation being outsourced. Not every US studio accepts the union. Pixar doesn't, right?

I'm not sure that unionizing is necessarily the solution... I'm not sure how legal it is though for studios to require 80 hour weeks though... I've never looked into it. I'd be surprised if many of us have. Where I'm at though, (not sure if it's because we get a tax credit) our hours are not permitted to exceed 60 per week.

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